. What is the current canonical age of Sansa, Bran and Arya Stark? As Wikipedi says about the claim that as a priest Sverre was too old to be the son of King Sigurd Mund: This particular objection has lost credence as it has become clear that this age limit was routinely ignored in Scandinavia at the time. Being that she is captive, being made to get married under duress would not make the marriage official , which would mean Tyrion Lannister would have no claim to the North. The only choice she had was between Tyrion and Lancel. And while Tyrion did protect them in some extent against Joffrey mistreatments, she ha The Tyrell family is considerably larger in the books than it is in the series, and Margaery and Loras actually have two elder brothers, Willas who is the oldest and heir to Highgarden, and Garlan. What is the correct way to screw wall and ceiling drywalls? Using indicator constraint with two variables. The emotional abuse is magnified The fallout of sexual abuse cannot be underestimated, but for Ramsay to add an extra layer of perversion by having her watched by a childhood friend, pushes it to another level. His love for her is unique. It may well be that there would be people in the North who would never accept a marriage of Sansa that Ned or Caitlyn didn't agree to, but unless they overthrow the ruler of the Seven Kingdoms, there's nothing they can do but submit to his decision. Sansa's marriage to Ramsay was, unfortunately, non-consensually consummated, meaning that Sansa is now legally a widow. But before we get too far ahead of ourselves, we mustn't forget that the eldest Stark daughter is still legally married to Tyrion Lannister, though their marriage was never consummated do the old and/or new gods allow for annulment in Westeros? (LINK IN BIO), A post shared by gameofthrones (@gameofthrones) on Jul 4, 2017 at 9:06am PDT. They were never fully married, even though Littlefinger told Roose Bolton that Sansa and Tyrions union was invalid because it was never consummated. When news of Olenna Tyrells plan to marry Sansa to her grandson Loras spread to Tywin Lannister, he arranged for Loras to be married to Cersei and Sansa to be married to Tyrion. Asking for help, clarification, or responding to other answers. So, by Coontzs logic, Sansa and Tyrion could still be married if those who witnessed the initial union are still committed to it. dead. Of course, the feminist in me hates to think that Sansa's whole future depends upon a marriage vow, but Westeros is not the real world. In Westeros, most marriages begin with a religious ceremony involving the exchange of vows in the presence of a sacred witness, depending on the couples faith. Is there a single-word adjective for "having exceptionally strong moral principles"? Learn more about Stack Overflow the company, and our products. In business terms, the smartest match for Sansa is her cousin, Robin Arryn. Why are physically impossible and logically impossible concepts considered separate in terms of probability? Both Margaery and Shae were suspicious of his intentions. Otto the Great made his daughter Mathilde (early 955-999), half sister of Liudolf, Abbess of Quedlinburg in 966, aged 11. She is still a child even though she has "Flowered" (Tryion says this when protesting the arrangement to his father), I would imagine being the same as an under-aged person in current times. Despite being forced to marry the imp of House Lannister, however, Sansa the traitor Ned Starks daughter begins to bond with him over their shared status in Kings Landing. A second ceremony could even be held to validate it. But even if it was, Sansa and Tyrion wouldn't need to hire whatever passes for a divorce lawyer in Westeros, because their marriage was never valid in the first place. Only a small percentage of us will know the t, I grew up in the golden age of the Disney Channel. Being that her Mother is still alive at this time, it would only be logical that she is the only one who could decide who her daughter was to marry. This means that the marriage was never made official in the eyes of the gods, and as such she is free to go on to marry anyone as officially, the marriage never took place. Just before Ramsay rapes Sansa, he starts to taunt her by asking why's she still a virgin, was she afraid of dwarf and so on. In the season eight premiere, Sansa is reunited with her first husband, and in no time flat, she's informing him that he's not as clever as she once thought he was if he really thinks his sister will send her army North. Wouldn't it be nice if Sansa decided to stay married to Tyrion instead of all this? I'm just hoping that Season 5 allows it. 23 hours ago, by Victoria Edel Martin, but it does resemble medieval Europe. Reg-Jean Page Reveals Why He *Really* Left 'Bridgerton', Eugene Levy Hints At A Schitts Creek Revival, Pedro Pascals Cameo In 'Buffy The Vampire Slayer' Is The Ultimate Throwback, Leonie Elliott Shared A Moving Message For Fans After Quitting 'Call The Midwife', Get Even More From Bustle Sign Up For The Newsletter. In that world (and their laws) that means the marriage of Sansa and Tyrion is not legal. ROOSE: And you prepared for the consequences. And if the parents or guardians asked the bride or groom they were not bound by his or her desires. An enemy? My code is GPL licensed, can I issue a license to have my code be distributed in a specific MIT licensed project. For years, we have been thetop moviegoers even though the films we watch rarely reflect our communities. Why Game of Thrones' Sansa twist is freaking out fans of the books. I'm not sure that this is a dupe - this is asking about a specific (answerable) part of the story, where the other is asking about a different element that is related. Connect and share knowledge within a single location that is structured and easy to search. Mutually exclusive execution using std::atomic? Desperate to provide a bride, Andronikos selected his daughter Simonis or Simonida (c. 1294-after 1336) despite the shocked opposition of the Patriarch of Constantinople and many family members. After six years of war, Sverre became king of Norway. It was not uncommon for a man to take a second wife or a concubine if his first didnt produce an heir, or to repudiate one wife for a more fertile or better-connected one. Read the Book Spoilers Now, Do Not Sell or Share My Personal Information. After Tyrion and Shae were married and Shae realized they were not intimate, she unsuccessfully tried to seduce Tyrion once more. Without him, Jaime has one hand and no allies, Tommen is a soft boy, not a king to fear. Please select the topics you're interested in: Would you like to turn on POPSUGAR desktop notifications to get breaking news ASAP? Does Counterspell prevent from any further spells being cast on a given turn? fear. That said, Huffington Post asked some experts what they thought and As a presumed bastard, she is no longer highborn and is thus able to secure a match with any status. Why does Mister Mxyzptlk need to have a weakness in the comics? Game of Thrones Wiki is a FANDOM TV Community. Movies & TV Stack Exchange is a question and answer site for movie and TV enthusiasts. Jeyne Poole, a childhood friend of Sansa's from Winterfell, avenge the death of her mother and brother. Peter Dinklage was great as Tyrion, but the show didnt go all the way to have him properly disfigured during the Battle of Blackwater. Sansa got m Even if she didnt object when it was prompted to her, she couldve objected during the ceremony or simply That said, it seems like Littlefinger had a different interpretation, since he handed Sansa over to the Boltons back in Season 5 with the assurance that the Stark was still a virgin. Either you are willfully ignoring the answers and this question has become pointless to answer, or you do not understand the answers and therefore do not understand the underlying premise of pretty much all events in Game of Thrones. Tywin offers Tyrion the opportunity to marry Sansa, and if Tyrion decided not to then Sansa would have likely been married to Kevan's son, Lancel Lannister. When season 7 left off, Sansa Stark, played by Sophie Turner, was Lady of Winterfell in her family home with her siblings Arya and Bran. Others do not share Tyrion's forward thinking. Science Fiction & Fantasy Stack Exchange is a question and answer site for science fiction and fantasy enthusiasts. A septon unites those who follow the Faith of the Seven, a priest or priestess does the same for believers in the Drowned God or Rhllor, and a Godswood heart tree is used by followers of the Old Gods. That depended a lot on whether the forced person made their objections publicly known - despite the possible dire threats of those forcing the marriage - and on how idealistic or cynical the local religious hierarchy was. In the moments following Joffreys death by poison at his wedding to Margaery Tyrell, Cersei pointed to Tyrion as the person responsible for Joffreys death, in part because Joffrey had ordered Tyrion to fill his glass of wine throughout the reception as his cupbearer. Or the crown just doesnt care. This can only happen if a septon agrees to dissolve the marriage. She is raped on her wedding night, beaten and tormented a storyline many disapprove of before she is able to break free of Ramsays clutches and find her way back to Jon. Can you provide references for the answer you have written? BAELISH: Queen Margaery adores Sansa. Saying they never consummated it was not sufficient to get it annulled, Karras said. Still, Game of Thrones showcases such a variety of ways that women can show strength. It was never consummated. In the rules of the show as Littlefinger tells Roose. Shes still a virgin, Tyrion never consummated the marriage by The Minimising the environmental effects of my dyson brain, Replacing broken pins/legs on a DIP IC package, Identify those arcade games from a 1983 Brazilian music video. Yet Tywin Lannister can force his daughter Cersei who is middle aged to marry Loras Tyrell. Tywin offers Tyrion the opportunity to marry Sansa, and if Tyrion decided not to then Sansa would have likely been married to Kevan's son, Lancel Lannister. When Joffrey declared it is time for their bedding ceremony, Tyrion refused and threatened Joffrey at first, but then played along and brought Sansa up to their bedchamber. Browse other questions tagged, Start here for a quick overview of the site, Detailed answers to any questions you might have, Discuss the workings and policies of this site. What episode does Ramsay marry Sansa? "I understand your reluctance. Cry if you must. In your place, I would likely rip my hair out. He's a loathsome little imp, no doubt of it, b Sansa's desire to go to King's Landing proves that she wants to be part of the royal court. Joffreys parents or rather his father the King made the request of marriage because of his close relationship with Eddard. It may be several seasons before the two are reunited, but I would love it if they ultimately fell in love for real. Could Season 5 transfer this plot to Sansa? 2 minutes ago, by Sarah Wasilak The prospect of a Ramsay and Sansa marriage is a Game of Thrones theory popular amongst fans right now. By the law of the land, she's no man's wife. Sansa says and she never does. Part of HuffPost Entertainment. So Sansa' marriage to Ramsay in the show was illegal and not binding as she was already Tyrion's wife. Tywin is Waymar Royce is the son of Yohn Royce, the man who becomes one of Sansa's closest advisers in the series, and Sansa falls head over heels in love with Waymar when she meets him at Winterfell, where he and his father stop on their way to the Wall. Sansa knows now that partnerships can be weapons if wielded correctly. Over time, the two developed a relationship and Tyrion brought Shae back to Kings Landing and she took on the position as handmaiden for Sansa so the two could safely and secretly be together. It does say the sources imply King Sigurd was born before his father became king in 1130. One other Westerosi marriage was successfully annulled on the show to make Rhaegar Targaryen and Lyanna Starks marriage valid. Sansa never trusted Tyrion and she Because she was an asset. The Lady of Winterfell, and, by extension, the North. Thats why the Tyrells wanted her for Willas. The Reach and the Nor At the same time, in the world of ASOIAF they believe that they can check to see if her maidenhood is intact, which it would be. Learn more about Stack Overflow the company, and our products. Sansa has picked up a lot from her friend and confident Margaery Tyrell, and Cersei Lannister, for that matter. I'm going to accept this on the basis of them being as good as annulled due to nobody who would be willing to say otherwise . However, Ruth Mazo Karras, Lecky Professor of History at What a King or Queen or even lesser royalty orders you to do is law. Without him, Siblings get busy in towers, aunts and nephews rendezvous on the Narrow Sea and sworn virgins run off with wildling women. Fire & Blood, Sansa practicing her needlework with Septa, Sansa and her family await the arrival of the king in "Winter Is Coming. Going into The Last Of Us, a series about a zombie apocalypse, you expect it wont be a lighthearted romp. Who is the third man that Sandor Clegane is referring to? She's not going to make the same mistakes that her Is it suspicious or odd to stand by the gate of a GA airport watching the planes? She was in exile after murder of Joffrey but then married to Tyrion. Except Baelish and the Boltons, I mean? Even if they separated, they wouldnt be able to marry anybody else.. Tyrion and Sansa officially said I do in Season 3 at the demand of Tywin Lannister (Charles Dance), and it becomes a humiliating affair for both bride and groom. separated, they wouldn't be able to marry anybody else. Sansa and Tyrion last see each other at Joffrey's wedding in season four, an occasion that ends in the young king's death and Sansa fleeing King's Landing. Game of Thrones returns on Sunday and I'm already nervous about Sansa. Do new devs get fired if they can't solve a certain bug? This is a setback for Sansa The eldest Stark daughter has not just survived, but thrived. And unless the parents of a person were the monarchs other persons might have the right or power to override the parental authority with superior feudal or other authority. http://fmg.ac/Projects/MedLands/ENGLAND,%20Kings%201066-1603.htm#EdwardIVdied14838. Warning: Big spoilers for Game of Thrones below! This is confirmed by Petyr Baelish in season 5 of Game of Thrones when he is setting up the wedding between Sansa and Ramsay. But the Medieval Lands site doesn't give a birth year for King Sigurd. For example Liudolf (930?-957) was made Duke of Saxony by his Father Otto the Great (912-973) in 950. Ten years before the events of the series, Theon was taken hostage by Eddard Stark. Connect and share knowledge within a single location that is structured and easy to search. A place where magic is studied and practiced? The North is already in open revolt, so the Lannisters (who are controlling Joffrey right now) don't need to worry about what they think, and are using Joffrey's power as the king to cement a claim to Winterfell through marriage (and eventually a half-Lannister, half-Stark child). The mother would only have the right to decide if the father was dead. And if it was a Friday, American History Has Been Whitewashed, But, Black Teen Girls On TV Are A Mess Finally, Sick Of TV? It truly comes down to what makes Entertainment Weekly mentioned in their set report that "Ramsay finds a new plaything to torture" this season. So it totally depends on which set of laws you apply.. Defying an order of the crown is treason and punishable by death. Where the Church was not powerful or present, marriage was controlled by private families, who made up their own rules more or less, Coontz said. Furthermore, Sigurd's illegitimate son King Haakon II the Broad-shouldered (1147-1162) was born as early as 1147, just 2 years after 1145. http://fmg.ac/Projects/MedLands/NORWAY.htm#SigurdHaraldssonMunddied11554. Is there enough evidence of Sansa Stark turning against House Stark? Joffrey made Sansas nuptials to Tyrion even more traumatic for her by threatening to rape her on her wedding night. By the law of the land, she's no man's wife. Except Baelish and the Boltons, I mean? Those plans fall But who's informed anybody that Tyrion didn't consummate? The best answers are voted up and rise to the top, Not the answer you're looking for? Cersei continued Sansa's imprisonment with the Lannisters by making Sansa marry Tyrion. She and Jon Snow have bigger fish to fry. Stack Exchange network consists of 181 Q&A communities including Stack Overflow, the largest, most trusted online community for developers to learn, share their knowledge, and build their careers. Petyr "Littlefinger" Baelish explained this while talking to Roose Bolton in the episode "High Sparrow": BAELISH: (They begin walking). It was common in most past ages of European society for parents or guardians to arrange marriages without consulting the bride or groom. Why didn't Cersei kill Dany, Tyrion and the rest of the others? For a while, this certainly seemed like this is what Littlefinger was after, right? Sansa is posing as a bastard and Ramsay is a legitimized bastard. By clicking Accept all cookies, you agree Stack Exchange can store cookies on your device and disclose information in accordance with our Cookie Policy. A place where magic is studied and practiced? RELATED:Game Of Thrones: 10 Weirdest Foods In The Realm. How to notate a grace note at the start of a bar with lilypond? Game of Thrones airs Sundays at 9/8c on HBO. I know that Tywin brokered the marriage of Tyrion to Sansa in order to prevent her from being wed to a Tyrell, but why did Sansa agree to it? The biggest issue is that when Sansa was to marry Joffrey, she had to wait for her parents consent and since her mother is still alive why does she not have to wait Tyrion was referring to Sansa's childish naivet. Joffrey's second fiance, Margaery Tyrell, briefly tries to have Sansa marry her brother so that she can be sent to the safe haven of Highgarden. Now that Sansa and Tyrion are both in Winterfell, don't expect her to change her last name to Lannister. Has 90% of ice around Antarctica disappeared in less than a decade? I assure you she's still a virgin. As Cott pointedly said, Its fantasy anyway, why aim for real detail?. Browse other questions tagged, Start here for a quick overview of the site, Detailed answers to any questions you might have, Discuss the workings and policies of this site. But by the end of this episode, nobody died, except for perhaps that child inside of us. My code is GPL licensed, can I issue a license to have my code be distributed in a specific MIT licensed project? In practical terms, the pope and again, this is in medieval Europe might have been more willing to annul a marriage that hadnt been consummated on other grounds, but the fact that it was not consummated was not grounds for annulment.. Just as Ramsay forces Sansa to submit, the camera pulls away to only show Theon's face and his reactions, and it is a mirror of all of our suffering -- he cries, he's anguished, he cannot help someone he cares for from being hurt. ncdu: What's going on with this second size column? Were Sansa and Arya aware of Littlefingers deceptive plan all along? However, arranging the match is no easy task, as Harry is a highborn lord and he believes that Sansa is just the bastard Alayne Stone. Why, on a show full of murder, torture and other rape, is this scene that much more disturbing and disappointing? Instead, after the outdoor wedding ceremony, Sansa and Ramsay retired to their chambers where the groom decided to brutally take his new bride's virginity. I think the Boltons, who were heavily involved in the massacre at the Red Wedding, would know better than to try to marry Ramsay off to someone else after that promise had been made. Here's the Deal, The "Stranger Things" Prequel Stage Play Dives Deep Into Vecna's Origin Story, Can't Wait For "Daisy Jones & The Six"? When Margaery took the role of Joffrey's Queen, Sansa believed she was finally free of her nightmare. By joining TV Guide, you agree to our Terms of Use and acknowledge the data practices in our Privacy Policy. Though an official religious marriage ceremony performed by a priest as was usual for nobility and royalty would usually have a point where the two parties said they consented to the marriage. You are assuming your standards of an official marriage apply in a very different setting that doesn't have the same morals - and where most characters don't even follow those different morals either. Asking for help, clarification, or responding to other answers. Sansa has picked up a lot from her friend and confident Margaery Tyrell, and Cersei Lannister, for that matter. Did Petyr Baelish intend for Lysa to see him kiss Sansa Stark? Princess Agnes of France (1171/72-1220 or after 1240), daughter of king Louis VII, was sent to Constantinople in 1179 and married or betrothed to Emperor Alexios II (1169-1183) on 2 March 1180. The context is mildly important. After the filming of the episode in which Sansa's direwolf. Inspect her, if you must. Who is "the valonqar" from Cersei's prophecy? "I won't share your bed," Tyrion tells her on their wedding night. Thanks for contributing an answer to Science Fiction & Fantasy Stack Exchange! Stack Exchange network consists of 181 Q&A communities including Stack Overflow, the largest, most trusted online community for developers to learn, share their knowledge, and build their careers.